Burke's General Armory

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Joseph M James
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Burke's General Armory

Post by Joseph M James » Mon Jul 18, 2016 5:22 pm

I'm a history buff and when I have time I like to open Burke's General Armory to any page, then read the names and the descriptions of their arms. Are there resources available to find out more about these people, such as first names and when they were granted their arms. Thank you, in advance for you help. Joseph (joe) M James

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Martin Goldstraw
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Re: Burke's General Armory

Post by Martin Goldstraw » Wed Jul 20, 2016 12:07 pm

The Harleian Manuscripts are useful. Many have been transcribed and published in the various Visitations records and there is also (the less useful) Grantees of Arms. Most of the Visitations books can be found in digital format on-line at Archive dot org, just search for "Visitations" or "Heraldic Visitations" in the archive dot org site.

The beauty of the Visitations is that not only do they provide details of the arms but there are also pedigrees.

https://archive.org/details/granteesofarmsna66fost

https://archive.org/search.php?query=He ... isitations
Martin Goldstraw

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Joseph M James
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Re: Burke's General Armory

Post by Joseph M James » Wed Jul 20, 2016 6:32 pm

Thank you Mr. Goldstraw, While waiting for a reply I discovered the Harleian Manuscripts and have started going through them. With Burke's General Armory I get very interested when I run across a coa that is very simple, such as one chevron, one lion or one boar ( just made up examples) and nothing else. With the little I know about heraldry I imagine these are very old and I wonder about them. I digitized Siebmacher's Index here at home and it is different from Burke's General Armory in that you can look up a name, then it gives you the different areas of the Empire where armigers of that name would have been found which gives you the vol. and even the pg. number of the vol. ( many of which can be found on Ancestry.com, just type in Siebmacher then click on the ancestry.com site ,but all of you probably know this. I really wish Burke's had done the same kind of notation or maybe they did and I just haven't found it. Now, a question, In going through Burke's I at times see (temp.) followed by a king or queens name. What does temp. mean? If the definition is in there I keep missing it. I understand when I see something like 8 Henry VIII. Thank You for any help, Joseph M James

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Michael F. McCartney
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Re: Burke's General Armory

Post by Michael F. McCartney » Thu Jul 21, 2016 6:03 am

"Temp" followed by the name of a king means roughly 'in the time of" that king, without specifying a which year of his reign.

Note that Burke is a mix of arms actually granted or confirmed by the official heralds in England, Scotland or Ireland, and other arms collected from various (usually unspecified) sources, which may or may not have ever been bestowed or blessed by the heraldic priesthood. Also, as might be expected in such a large compendium, there are sometimes errors in the heraldic details. A useful place to start, or to search for clues, but not "the" authoritative final proof.
Mike~~
Fremont, California

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Martin Goldstraw
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Re: Burke's General Armory

Post by Martin Goldstraw » Sat Jul 23, 2016 9:03 am

I have yet to pluck up the courage to spend the vast sums required in the purchase of the four volume set, recently completed, by Chesshyre and Woodcock " Dictionary of British Arms: Medieval Ordinary". This I am led to believe is authoritative and referenced. Papworth's Ordinary, which I do own, is also (in the main) referenced.

At the risk of teaching grandma to suck eggs, an Ordinary is a collection of arms arranged alphabetically according to their designs, as opposed to an armory which is arranged alphabetically by surname. If one is intent on identifying armorial bearings an Ordinary is far more useful than an armory though in the case of the Dictionary of British Arms: A Medieval Ordinary the indices of the four volumes also acts as an armory.
Martin Goldstraw

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Joseph M James
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Re: Burke's General Armory

Post by Joseph M James » Sat Jul 23, 2016 11:56 pm

Thank you Mr. McCartney. I had a feeling that's what temp. meant, but it never hurts to ask. I also have a feeling the things I'm looking for are written on vellum probably in latin on a shelf in the Tower. Thank you again Mr. Goldstraw. I discovered Papworth's yesterday (fri.) but again found the same coas and names with no further info. I'm going to see if I can find vol. 1 of the Dictionary of British Arms in the interlibrary loan system. If I like it and can get it home for 2 weeks It might be the next book I digitize because they are out of my price range right now.It's a pain, takes alot of time and coffee, but I'm happy with the two books I've already done. Don't worry about teaching grandma to suck eggs, you are welcome to just keep piling info on me. Joseph M James

Joseph M James
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Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2016 1:30 pm
Location: BUCKINGHAM,FL.

Re: Burke's General Armory

Post by Joseph M James » Mon Jul 25, 2016 4:19 am

On further investigation the Dictionary of British Arms vol. 1 thru 4 are way to new for me to digitize.I'm willing to push some laws a little, but that is too much. I guess I'll have to save my pennies if I like them.

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Michael F. McCartney
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Re: Burke's General Armory

Post by Michael F. McCartney » Mon Jul 25, 2016 2:32 pm

If you can get (borrow) from the interlibrary loan system, that's great for any particular items on your "to do" list at that point in time. Beyond that, it's piggy bank time... :)

Though you might be able to find which (if any) libraries in your area actually have copies; likely in their reference collection that you can't check out, but can go to that library as needed.
Mike~~
Fremont, California

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